RC-Powerboat-Forum.de » 3. Aufbau » Aufbau u. Bootvorstellung Elektrisch » mystic 185

juve, 13.01.2013, 21:51
all here is it's been a long time that I am on the forum your project from France, I am in awe I am two years on my mystic assembly 185. the set up of my boat is: two engines power tp 1050 kv, two 330amp hifei in 10s propellers 6017/3, for the moment my max speed is 126km / h. I have a big problem with heater and controller, this is the right side. the average run of 4 minutes with twice 16000amp 10s. I have taken my water closer to the sharp angle of pattins and flush with the back panel. is there someone who can help me solve my problem .. I'll put pictures and also the last video. thank you

juve, 13.01.2013, 21:51

all

here is it's been a long time that I am on the forum your project from France, I am in awe ;-)

I am two years on my mystic assembly 185.
the set up of my boat is: two engines power tp 1050 kv, two 330amp hifei in 10s
propellers 6017/3, for the moment my max speed is 126km / h.

I have a big problem with heater and controller, this is the right side.
the average run of 4 minutes with twice 16000amp 10s.

I have taken my water closer to the sharp angle of pattins and flush with the back panel.

is there someone who can help me solve my problem ..

I'll put pictures and also the last video.

thank you

mudl, 13.01.2013, 22:02
Hello what weight has your 185 totaly. I think your boat ist to heavy and your props are to big There are to many Lipos inside for 4 minutes Show us a photo from the bottom of your boat to see the waterinlets. bye mudl

juve, 13.01.2013, 22:41
hello mudl the boat is 13.8 kg vacuum. I use zippy lipos 8000. I'll put pictures as soon as possible. thank you

juve, 13.01.2013, 22:45
sorry for the white of the video, it does not work???? link to youtubehttp / www.youtube.com/watch?v=j1op9FVl2MA This is the video of this after noon

Tobbi, 14.01.2013, 13:44
Maybe your mass centre is not right,you should drive smoothly without jumping all the time.A picture of your trims could help too. The Propshops are not so good(should be perfect made),i ve made best results with reduced 70-60 Octuras,or with 2 Blade Steel Props around 60mm,with TC,and without. Greets Tobbi

juve, 14.01.2013, 18:53
hello Here is a picture of my trans. shell on a table I the axis 1.1 cm. the position of my lipos this is a 37cm TA interior. This gives me a CG of 28.5%.

mudl, 14.01.2013, 19:09
Hello in the video you drive nearly the complete time with half speed. This is not good for Motors and escs. They got very hot. How have you progged your escs? Timing PWM Throttle. How much mah from the lipos you need for this 4minutes run? Can you say me the complete weight of your boat ready to run.(with motors,escs,lipos) you have 8 kilos of Lipos in your 185,This is the same as i drive in my 240 Mystic. And i think thats to much. Try smaler props and lower weight,than you can go full speed and i think your components are cool. bye mudl

mudl, 14.01.2013, 19:09

Hello

in the video you drive nearly the complete time with half speed.
This is not good for Motors and escs.
They got very hot.
How have you progged your escs?
Timing
PWM
Throttle.

How much mah from the lipos you need for this 4minutes run?

Can you say me the complete weight of your boat ready to run.(with motors,escs,lipos)
you have 8 kilos of Lipos in your 185,This is the same as i drive in my 240 Mystic.
And i think thats to much.

Try smaler props and lower weight,than you can go full speed and i think your components are cool.

bye
mudl

manuelw, 14.01.2013, 20:01
10S2P 8000mAh 30C cells is really a lot of weight, hobbyking says 1054g for one 5S packs so thats around 8.5kg pure lipo mass inside the boat. mudl runs 12S2P 5000mAh 45C cells as far as I know in his Mystic 240, at 888g pack according to Hobbyking, thats 7.1kg for 8 packs. So alone that lipo configuration is really heavy, thats 1.5kg more than what mudl is driving in a bigger MHZ Mystic 240 regards, Manuel

manuelw, 14.01.2013, 20:01

10S2P 8000mAh 30C cells is really a lot of weight, hobbyking says 1054g for one 5S packs so thats around
8.5kg pure lipo mass inside the boat. mudl runs 12S2P 5000mAh 45C cells as far as I know in his Mystic 240,
at 888g pack according to Hobbyking, thats 7.1kg for 8 packs.
So alone that lipo configuration is really heavy, thats 1.5kg more than what mudl is driving in a bigger MHZ
Mystic 240 :denk2:

regards,
Manuel

juve, 14.01.2013, 22:04
hello setting my CONTROS: lvc = auto cutoff = 3.2 v brake type = no timing advance = middle cutoff type = soft startup type = soft = 8khz pwm rate There are two engines per pack 5s8000mah = 10s / engines 2kg060gr weight lipo packs / motors for I 120% throttle on my radio futaba3pk

mudl, 14.01.2013, 22:21
Hello you must prog the contoller with 80% on your transmitter and than after progging race to 120% Timing on auto. PWM to 12khz. With this settings i got best results with the 300 hifeis. bye mudl

Alex123, 14.01.2013, 23:07
Don`t forget the props! PS 60/3 is too big for the TPs. Alex

Javasledge, 15.01.2013, 13:31
juve hat folgendes geschrieben: hello setting my CONTROS: lvc = auto cutoff = 3.2 v brake type = no timing advance = middle cutoff type = soft startup type = soft = 8khz pwm rate There are two engines per pack 5s8000mah = 10s / engines 2kg060gr weight lipo packs / motors for I 120% throttle on my radio futaba3pk There are a lot of good and experienced experts here but i'll just give my 5cent I would go for low voltage cuttoff at 2,8v and set the LVC to manual. This is my standard ESC-setup. The ESC's might just cut-off because of this, even with 8000mah capacity. A view on the logs will show this. I'ts a great boat and it is interesting to see where the issues is and to learn Best regards Finn

Javasledge, 15.01.2013, 13:31

juve hat folgendes geschrieben:

hello
setting my CONTROS:
lvc = auto cutoff = 3.2 v brake type = no timing advance = middle cutoff type = soft
startup type = soft = 8khz pwm rate

There are two engines per pack 5s8000mah = 10s / engines
2kg060gr weight lipo packs / motors

for I 120% throttle on my radio futaba3pk

There are a lot of good and experienced experts here but i'll just give my 5cent :-)

I would go for low voltage cuttoff at 2,8v and set the LVC to manual. This is my standard ESC-setup. The
ESC's might just cut-off because of this, even with 8000mah capacity. A view on the logs will show this. I'ts
a great boat and it is interesting to see where the issues is and to learn :-)

Best regards

Finn

dropps_vb, 15.01.2013, 14:25
Javasledge hat folgendes geschrieben: I would go for low voltage cuttoff at 2,8v ....... Finn cuttoff at 2,8 V ???? this is too low. Normal cutoff for a lipo-cell is 3,3 to 3,5 Volt. But 2,8 Volt.... that will destroy the cells.

juve, 15.01.2013, 20:58
hello and thank you for your answers I'll redo the programing of CONTROS with 80% of the radio. you think the 6017/3 are not suitable??? if I have octura x470.

Javasledge, 16.01.2013, 20:22
dropps_vb hat folgendes geschrieben: cuttoff at 2,8 V ???? this is too low. Normal cutoff for a lipo-cell is 3,3 to 3,5 Volt. But 2,8 Volt.... that will destroy the cells. Hi Jens, I know I'm pushing it to the limit but it works for me Juve - please don't take this as an advice, just my own experience Greetings Finn

dropps_vb, 16.01.2013, 21:21
Javasledge hat folgendes geschrieben: dropps_vb hat folgendes geschrieben: cuttoff at 2,8 V ???? this is too low. Normal cutoff for a lipo-cell is 3,3 to 3,5 Volt. But 2,8 Volt.... that will destroy the cells. Hi Jens, I know I'm pushing it to the limit but it works for me Juve - please don't take this as an advice, just my own experience Greetings Finn yeah...but this got nothing to do with the limits. this is far behind the limits. but do what you like. best regards

dropps_vb, 16.01.2013, 21:21

Javasledge hat folgendes geschrieben:

dropps_vb hat folgendes geschrieben:

cuttoff at 2,8 V ???? :heul:

this is too low.
Normal cutoff for a lipo-cell is 3,3 to 3,5 Volt.
But 2,8 Volt.... that will destroy the cells.

Hi Jens, I know I'm pushing it to the limit but it works for me :-)

Juve - please don't take this as an advice, just my own experience :-)

Greetings
Finn

yeah...but this got nothing to do with the limits. this is far behind the limits.
but do what you like.

best regards

mudl, 16.01.2013, 21:59
Hello X470 is much to big. For example a octura X457 is good in my opinion. or you try a two blade steel prop with maximum 60 mm and a pitch of 1,25 bye mudl

juve, 16.01.2013, 23:02
ok thank you for the info ca will not be easy to find as my axis propellers 1/4 if I saw the prop shop in 5517

juve, 03.02.2013, 20:29
hello Here is a summary of the navigation of this afternoon. I redid one full of prog CONTROS and also with the following radio to your advice. I would say a good day. Here the data precalculated of CONTROS, see photos. max rpm = 26,799 and 26,786 for the right to the left. max = 42.3 volt v 43v right and left. the direction of rotation of the propellers inwards, my propellers 6017/3. max speed 130km / h I need help cooling. how made to the entry of water under the hull??????? I put a tube inside diameter 5mm on the angle of the hull and closer to the table and I back through the engine and controversial. CONTROS the heat and the water outlet on the outside running low. thank you for your support ...

juve, 03.02.2013, 20:29

hello
Here is a summary of the navigation of this afternoon.
I redid one full of prog CONTROS and also with the following radio to your advice.
I would say a good day.
Here the data precalculated of CONTROS, see photos.
max rpm = 26,799 and 26,786 for the right to the left.
max = 42.3 volt v 43v right and left.
the direction of rotation of the propellers inwards, my propellers 6017/3.
max speed 130km / h :tup:

I need help cooling.
how made to the entry of water under the hull??????? :heul:

I put a tube inside diameter 5mm on the angle of the hull and closer to the table and I back through the
engine and controversial.
CONTROS the heat and the water outlet on the outside running low.
thank you for your support ...

mudl, 03.02.2013, 22:00
Hello your props are to big At your run you had 26000 rpm. Your motor are 1050 KV with 10s Lipos. RPM in this setup must be about 35000 rpm. Your RPM is 9000 lower as it must be and that is the reason why your setup is going hot. Your setting of the throttle is 5% to deep.You must have 100%. For waterinlet i set a 5mm tube in an angle of 90 degrees to the bottom of the boat and make a 2-3 zentimeter long waterinlet with a depp of one millimeter infront of the tube. And this works great in every of my boats bye mudl

mudl, 03.02.2013, 22:00

Hello

your props are to big
At your run you had 26000 rpm.
Your motor are 1050 KV with 10s Lipos.
RPM in this setup must be about 35000 rpm.
Your RPM is 9000 lower as it must be and that is the reason why your setup is going hot.
Your setting of the throttle is 5% to deep.You must have 100%.

For waterinlet i set a 5mm tube in an angle of 90 degrees to the bottom of the boat and make a 2-3 zentimeter
long waterinlet with a depp of one millimeter infront of the tube.
And this works great in every of my boats

bye
mudl

Backeddy, 03.02.2013, 22:22
Laurent, you were told in most of the answers several timesto use smaller props, I wonder why you did not do so? Just listen to mudl and everything is gonna be fine!

juve, 03.02.2013, 23:27
Backeddy hat folgendes geschrieben: Laurent, you were told in most of the answers several timesto use smaller props, I wonder why you did not do so? Just listen to mudl and everything is gonna be fine! I'm willing to put smaller muld like me said, but I find no octura X457 propellers for shaft 6.35 mm, I think for the 4.75 mm

rhomodel, 04.02.2013, 16:32
You can easily buy propshaft of 3/8 and glue or solder these on the flexi's. You can then use all propellers: both 1/4 inch and 3/8 as you have 2 sets of propshafts.

juve, 06.02.2013, 18:21
hello test this weekend here is the video.

juve, 06.02.2013, 18:26
hello test this weekend here is the video. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9PHBtyv9JoI 126 km / h and 130 in the last run. adjustment controversy with 8khz in pvm, 3.2 v cutoffvolt the rest by car and soft motors and lipos warm, CONTROS warmer. I did a test to see if empty I am a 100% back on gas CONTROS yes I am a 102%. setting the radio epa 120% So with 3.840 v / cell lipos on, I get the motor 39320rpm left and right 39114. adjustment controversial in pvm 8khz lvc = auto timing = auto v = 3.2 volt cutoff and startup cutofftype + = soft question, if I lower the cutoff to 2.8 volt v what impact??????????? thank you

juve, 06.02.2013, 18:26

hello
test this weekend
here is the video.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9PHBtyv9JoI

126 km / h and 130 in the last run.
adjustment controversy with 8khz in pvm, 3.2 v cutoffvolt the rest by car and soft
motors and lipos warm, CONTROS warmer.

I did a test to see if empty I am a 100% back on gas CONTROS
yes I am a 102%.
setting the radio epa 120%
So with 3.840 v / cell lipos on, I get the motor 39320rpm left and right 39114.
adjustment controversial in pvm 8khz
lvc = auto
timing = auto
v = 3.2 volt cutoff and startup cutofftype + = soft

question, if I lower the cutoff to 2.8 volt v what impact???????????

thank you

Chaotixx, 06.02.2013, 18:36
If i have unterstand your question right, you can destroy your LiPo if the Cell-Voltage drop lower than 2,8; better 3,0V. Greetings Alex

dropps_vb, 06.02.2013, 18:43
juve hat folgendes geschrieben: ..... question, if I lower the cutoff to 2.8 volt v what impact??????????? thank you you can buy new lipos. 2.8 volt.....seriously man, that´s too low.

dropps_vb, 06.02.2013, 18:50
juve hat folgendes geschrieben: hello test this weekend here is the video. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9PHBtyv9JoI 126 km / h and 130 in the last run. adjustment controversy with 8khz in pvm, 3.2 v cutoffvolt the rest by car and soft motors and lipos warm, CONTROS warmer. I did a test to see if empty I am a 100% back on gas CONTROS yes I am a 102%. setting the radio epa 120% So with 3.840 v / cell lipos on, I get the motor 39320rpm left and right 39114. adjustment controversial in pvm 8khz lvc = auto timing = auto v = 3.2 volt cutoff and startup cutofftype + = soft question, if I lower the cutoff to 2.8 volt v what impact??????????? thank you just saw it the second time i read your post. IF you have 39000 rpm und IF you have used some props with 57mm diameter and a pitch of 80mm (like x457 Octuras) your speed should be near to 100 mph, or 160 km/h. In your case, nothing fits together. nicer the speed, nor the current.

dropps_vb, 06.02.2013, 18:50

juve hat folgendes geschrieben:

just saw it the second time i read your post.
IF you have 39000 rpm und IF you have used some props with 57mm diameter and a pitch of 80mm (like x457
Octuras) your speed should be near to 100 mph, or 160 km/h.

In your case, nothing fits together. nicer the speed, nor the current.

juve, 06.02.2013, 21:15
yes I agree, 2.8 V and low. this is an example, being from 3.2 to 3v is more reasonable to me, I think .. 39000rpm for is a vacuum, without propellers and shafts. I wanted to know if CONTROS took good 100% throttle, gas background I awaiting delivery octura x457 L / R thank you for your answers

juve, 18.02.2013, 22:17
hello I would have a little information on the direction of rotation of the propellers on a cat, that provides rotation outwards???????? on video, http://youtu.be/64C0xCU2Jls I turned inwards, the hull regulator nose as soon as I accelerated a bit, I have a centering to 28%. I look forward to receiving my x457 for testing propellers thank you for your help

juve, 06.10.2013, 22:58
hello all here is the last video of my mystic 185 http://youtu.be/e-BGjnYFWNU I put in 820 kv 10s with x470 octura the consomation is elevated more 300AMP peak. Since I tested the 6017/3 in 12s = 139 km / h without being thoroughly because it was windy. test 10s with same helices = 125 km / h. 240 amp max and peak. I tuning in controversy lvc = auto timing = middle cut off = 3v PWM = 12kHz for the timing, the new version of hifei allows precise adjustment of the timing, I would like to try but what?????? my engines are tp 820kv power in thank you

juve, 06.10.2013, 22:58

hello all
here is the last video of my mystic 185

http://youtu.be/e-BGjnYFWNU

I put in 820 kv 10s with x470 octura the consomation is elevated more 300AMP peak.

Since I tested the 6017/3 in 12s = 139 km / h without being thoroughly because it was windy.
test 10s with same helices = 125 km / h. 240 amp max and peak.

I tuning in controversy lvc = auto
timing = middle
cut off = 3v
PWM = 12kHz

for the timing, the new version of hifei allows precise adjustment of the timing, I would like to try but
what??????
my engines are tp 820kv power in

thank you